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[LCK] Spring 2019 - Page 15

Forum Index > LoL Tournaments
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Redox
Profile Joined October 2010
Germany12077 Posts
April 13 2019 17:39 GMT
#281
I was so happy when SKT won, went to check out Liquibet ranking and then saw I was way down. Turns out I had actually not bet on SKT as I was sure I had lol.
Off-season = best season
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7524 Posts
April 15 2019 08:01 GMT
#282
Im very confused by Griff. I understand that Faker' didn't seem like the problem in Game 1 and Game 3, but no sane person could argue they made him the least bit uncomfortable in any of the drafts. TBH, who on SKY did they even try to make uncomfortable? Give Faker scaling carries. Ez and Lucian for Teddy. Standards at support/jungle. And Khan got a trololol Riven pick to close it.
Freeeeeeedom
evilfatsh1t
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia320 Posts
April 15 2019 09:42 GMT
#283
game 1 was basically a cheese strat that didnt work out.
game 2 they played standard because they are more than capable on a good day, but chovy and viper choked hard.
game 3 was griffin not expecting to win the series because theyre all tilted anyway
DarkCore
Profile Joined March 2011
Germany3021 Posts
April 15 2019 11:51 GMT
#284
The strat didn't work out because Teddy got caught out exactly once by Panth, sometime in the middle of game 3 when it didn't matter anymore. And he somehow managed to farm well both games as well. And yeah, Chovy choked so hard this series, the pressure must've gotten to him. Viper and Sword looked mediocre or outclassed most of the series too.

Banning Faker out is a sure recipe for getting dumpstered elsewhere on the map. For example, GRF banned Tahm in the first round twice because Tahm Ez is stupid in pro play right now, Tahm also works well with a bunch of other comps. Khan is also a good Jayce player, and the champ is S tier, no real losing lanes. Morg is too strong and versatile this patch, hence perma ban.

SKT first picked Ryze twice, a safe champ that has no real counters that are meta, and scales super hard. The other time they picked Azir into Liss, super safe lane for him if Clid knows what he's doing (hint, he does). There are too many good mid champs that Faker can play to try and ban him out.
Fixed a bug where LeBlanc could lose
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7524 Posts
April 15 2019 20:01 GMT
#285
Even if you aren't going after faker, which I agree is often dumb, can't you make someone uncomfortable? I just seemed to me they were all in on the cheese strat and they psyched themselves into thinking that was the only way they could win.

I guess its also a bit of a problem with the LCK gauntlet system. The #1 seed playing only 1 game is boring, we want to see them more. The LEC has probably the best playoffs currently that mixes rewarding the regular season with actually testing all the teams, but I also prefer the LCS system to this. The gauntlet was more fun when it was for qualification only.
Freeeeeeedom
Urthor
Profile Joined May 2017
Australia23 Posts
April 16 2019 01:12 GMT
#286
The LCK system makes the regular season games hype though because teams actually care about the standings at the end of the day. Which is the most important thing.
JimmiC
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada11121 Posts
April 16 2019 01:22 GMT
#287
Perhaps but the 1st place team has no.momentum
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7524 Posts
April 16 2019 03:33 GMT
#288
Its not just no momentum, the meta shifts so fast in LOL that they end up having too little stage experience with the newest champs. Not only had they not played in 13 days, they played only 2 series on 9.6. In that week morg was only banned in the first round of bans once. Which shows how much was learned.
Freeeeeeedom
AdsMoFro
Profile Joined January 2015
Australia2980 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-16 05:18:36
April 16 2019 05:17 GMT
#289
I mean, 1st has lost, what twice in ten series? Don't think it's that big of an issue for the first place team. Hype wise, I'm inclined to want to see first play more but yeah
AdministratorQue Sera Sera
JimmiC
Profile Joined May 2011
Canada11121 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-16 05:26:19
April 16 2019 05:23 GMT
#290
I guess their advantage is they dont have to show anything. But yeah i prefer more games so.I like the other systems. Id go lec>lcs>lck for my preference.

Strange they all diff. Is china différent as well?
AdsMoFro
Profile Joined January 2015
Australia2980 Posts
April 16 2019 06:10 GMT
#291
On April 16 2019 14:23 JimmiC wrote:
I guess their advantage is they dont have to show anything. But yeah i prefer more games so.I like the other systems. Id go lec>lcs>lck for my preference.

Strange they all diff. Is china différent as well?


China seeds everyone in a bracket (1st/2nd straight to semis-3rd/4th Quarters-5th/6th/7th/8th wildcard bo3 i believe). Used to give the higher seed a one game advantage which doesn't happen anymore.
AdministratorQue Sera Sera
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7524 Posts
April 16 2019 06:29 GMT
#292
On April 16 2019 14:17 AdsMoFro wrote:
I mean, 1st has lost, what twice in ten series? Don't think it's that big of an issue for the first place team. Hype wise, I'm inclined to want to see first play more but yeah


2015 Spring GE Loses to SKT
2016 Spring ROX loses to SKT
2019 Spring GRF loses to SKT

But there are also instances where the #2 team lost its first match.

2016 Spring KT loses to SKT.
2016 Summer SKT loses to KT.
2017 Spring SSG loses to KT.
2017 Summer KT loses to SKT.

I guess one might just say you prolly just want to avoid SKT in playoffs. OTOH, it also seems like one of the reasons for the drought we had in #1 seeds being upset was due to a rash of #2 seeds being upset before they got into a rhythm.
Freeeeeeedom
AdsMoFro
Profile Joined January 2015
Australia2980 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-16 07:33:22
April 16 2019 07:28 GMT
#293
In other news, LCK Summer promotion in less than 2 hours! KT vs USG first up!
AdministratorQue Sera Sera
evilfatsh1t
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia320 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-04-16 09:11:46
April 16 2019 09:10 GMT
#294
On April 16 2019 05:01 cLutZ wrote:
Even if you aren't going after faker, which I agree is often dumb, can't you make someone uncomfortable? I just seemed to me they were all in on the cheese strat and they psyched themselves into thinking that was the only way they could win.

I guess its also a bit of a problem with the LCK gauntlet system. The #1 seed playing only 1 game is boring, we want to see them more. The LEC has probably the best playoffs currently that mixes rewarding the regular season with actually testing all the teams, but I also prefer the LCS system to this. The gauntlet was more fun when it was for qualification only.

griffins mentality going into game 2 is pretty straight forward imo. on the back of a loss on the cheese strat theyve prepared for near 2 weeks, the obvious response is to play standard and see if you can claw back a game. i think the idea going through everyone in griffins head at this point is "if we cant beat them in a standard game, we wont win the series".
skt's form was just too good for you to try and make them uncomfortable with drafting alone. you cant focus ban faker because his champion pool is too large, you cant ban out all of khans champions because bot and jg get to play whatever they want, you cant ban out clid and hope tarzan completely dominates jg because of form and because honestly the laners have too much presence to go completely unignored anyway. all you can do is just ban champions that are particularly annoying to deal with with the team you have in mind
after losing game 2 its just confirmation in their minds that skt is too good. they spent 2 weeks trying to prepare a strat that can give them momentum in the series and since winning 3 games with standard drafts is going to be difficult you might as well go back to your original plan and attempt to start over.
i do think griffin really screwed up their preparations for the finals overall though. 2 weeks of prep got them a strat that has such blatant shortcomings in terms of scaling and their pick ban order was extremely questionable. why would you pick taliyah panth as 2nd and 3rd picks and let their botlane play the best possible champions to deal with that, rather than waiting for their bot lane to be picked and picking taliyah panth at 4th and 5th pick if skt's bot lane is weaker (ie. not ezreal) or just pick standard.
the success of the bot lane has so much weighting on the game it should have been a complete surprise or just substituted for something much less risky. sona/taric would have been better even because at least they provide buffs to your other laners too and mid/top could still be relevant
cLutZ
Profile Joined November 2010
United States7524 Posts
April 16 2019 09:32 GMT
#295
True, but lets assume its correct to think Morg and Jayce are OP. Why are you banning both even on blue side? Don't you want one? Particularly Morg. If she's as strong as people are claiming, its a brilliant #1 pick as would be jayce. In game 1 & 3 they didn't even try to get SKT to ban one.

Hell, they banned Kench in 1 & 3 and people assume its because EZ-TK is a killer combo. But that was open in G2 and they didn't pick it!
Freeeeeeedom
DarkCore
Profile Joined March 2011
Germany3021 Posts
April 16 2019 11:54 GMT
#296
Not every team runs Tahm, he's not exactly a godlike pick, it's Ezreal which is the sore thumb. A quick check shows Mata played Tahm 13 games this split, his most played. Meanwhile Lehends played him twice. Also of note is that Mata has a 77% WR on him, compared to the 70% he has overall. So this is a clear target ban, GRF feels that Tahm was integral to many of SKT's wins, and if you watch the games you'll come to the same conclusion.

Jayce seems to be overall the same stats for both teams, sporting ~62% WR. Personally, I think Khan is a much better Jayce, mechanically speaking. But Chovy didn't play him once this split, so my guess is that the big power of Jayce as a flex pick is lost for GRF, SKT is going to predict that he's going to be in the top lane, meaning that they are free to pick a top laner later in the draft, and can greedily go for good picks in mid lane. Or they can straight up pick a top laner and force GRF to pick a safe mid laner, else Faker gets to counterpick. Either way, SKT is granted more flexibility.

Good chance that Chovy didn't practice Morg, or GRF thought SKT could abuse it better than them. The big problem of not banning these kinds of champions is that when you leave them open, you are kind of forced to pick them, leaves you open to getting counterpicked or the opponent building a full counter comp (for example, picking Orrn into Jayce, followed by a full engage comp, stopping Jayce from splitting). If you don't pick them, your own first pick has to consider playing against them.

Point is, SKT has pretty much always had godlike drafting, and I don't think we've ever praised GRF for the PB phase. In bo5, that's a really big advantage, hence their consistent domination when their team isn't shit.
Fixed a bug where LeBlanc could lose
evilfatsh1t
Profile Joined October 2010
Australia320 Posts
April 16 2019 15:33 GMT
#297
morg ban is obvious if you arent playing her because your bot lane gets completely shit on by 1 morg spell. tahm would be the same.
jayce is because khan is godlike at it and when your jg is going to be bot most of the time because you want to dive with panth and snowball your bot lane, you dont want a jayce playing with no pressure at top.
DarkCore
Profile Joined March 2011
Germany3021 Posts
April 16 2019 19:53 GMT
#298
I also completely forgot that Morg shield shits on Panth.
Fixed a bug where LeBlanc could lose
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