[Patch 6.17] 8th Rek'Sai Nerf General Discussion - Page 3
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
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Kinie
United States3106 Posts
On August 24 2016 23:27 Slusher wrote: The Vi change on Q knockback might seem weird, but it's actually the result of Riot reaching out to otp Vi player Super Metroid. He's a west coast player, and he has been complaining that since the server move his old BnB combo of Q>auto>E>Ult went from being garunteed to having to get lucky. He's been saying for a long time that this buff along with Gragas and Reksai being not so OP is all she needed, this patch seems to address those issues. The confusion here is that Q never listed the duration of the knockback, it was actually unknown. There is conflicting information between the patchnotes and Vi's designer. When Gypsylord messaged Metroid to ask him about Vi buffs, Metroid asked him how the knockback worked and he was told it was .5 seconds period (no variation like listed in the notes). Here is where I get a little unsure of what was actually changed, Metroid said if he could have 1 buff it would be to extend the knockback so he could execute his old BnB combo, that had a 100% execution rate when west coast ping was the best ping. Gypsylord responded that he felt this buff was too much, and that it probably wouldn't happen, he instead said he would ask the dev team to up the refresh time(client to server check) on Vi's knockup, thinking perhaps this would increase consistency on being able to do the combo or not. So he's Gypsylord was either wrong on the duration of the old knockup, or he changed his mind on just flat buffing the knockup, but I am sure it is intended as a buff at all levels as I would expect their QA team to try executing the combo at faked ping, but it's riot so who knows lol. UPDATE: apparently the knockup was .5 static, however the standard server check rate allowed for a variation of .5-.75, in other words it was a completely random variable, the ability has been buffed to .7 as well as having a flag to refresh the status with the server at a higher rate, to make it as consistently .7 as possible barring players with super bad ping etc. With this buff in place the Vi Q>auto>e>ult combo should be guaranteed before the player is able to flash/react. Mind you, that combo is basically the only one she has that let's her do burst damage (as her W passive will proc on the E AA reset, letting the ult do even more damage), and if some dumb player lets you straight up walk into them with a fully charged Q, or even Flash-Q > Auto > E AA reset > ult and not flash themselves or use their CC on you, they deserve to get blown up. Edit: As for the discussion about top tier junglers right now, Rek'Sai and Gragas were the best due to being able to sustain through the jungle with their kit (Rek'Sai burrow regen, Gragas passive) along with having decent clear speeds (her Qs and W, all of his abilities doing an AoE damage). Rek'Sai will still be picked because the tremorsense passive is too strong for competitive, and Gragas might be picked for team comps that need someone to disengage/single out targets with his ult for a peel or protect the ADC comp, which we've seen some teams do in LCS, LPL, and LCK. Elise and Nidalee will probably still be picked for early game ganks (Elise w/ her cocoon, Nidalee's burst damage if she lands a spear), and I don't know if you can nerf them any more without just making them unplayable, seeing as they've had a lot of nerfs in the past to get them here. Kindred will always be hovering near the top of possible "new meta" junglers because if her numbers ever get too good, she can wave clear super fast and just turn into another carry that is hard to disrupt and provides artificial tankiness in the form of her ult. And the issue with Hecarim is he needs level 6 and a lot more gold than most junglers to get rolling due to TF being so strong on him. But with the new "standard" of few lane swaps and laning phases lasting to the 10-15 minute mark, it might be enough time for him to farm up most of a TF and still be relevant for the first couple team fights. Vi, Pantheon, Graves, Diana (especially with her E buff), Lee (because of the Insec kick), and J4 are probably hovering in the same area as Kindred. But basically all these champs have some weakness (Vi can't get out when she goes in, Panth ult falls off late game, Graves needs ADC-tier gold to be strong late, Diana needs 8 items to be truly deadly, Lee and J4 fall off hard late game) that prevent them from being meta right now. Personally, the most likely "non-meta" junglers that I see becoming meta are Vi, Diana, and J4, all because they carry the Ori ball really, really well, and her ult buff is pretty huge, especially when you consider she tends to build Athenes/Morellos first item. Having her ult be up for basically every team fight starting at one 20% CDR item by level 6 is insane. For arguement's sake, imagine a team comp of Rumble top, one of these 3 junglers, and Ori mid. The wombo combo is insane. | ||
Slusher
United States19143 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
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General_Winter
United States719 Posts
Think any of these guys have what it takes for the big time? | ||
iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
On August 25 2016 06:36 General_Winter wrote: On champion gg the JGs with the best win rates are all odd picks like skarner or Kogmaw or Ap picks like Sol or fiddle. (I actually like sol a lot if your team helps you ward for the first few levels). Think any of these guys have what it takes for the big time? No. They require too many resources / enemy mistakes to flourish in pro. They are good soloqueue picks though. | ||
Slusher
United States19143 Posts
Vi's buff is good, but like you said she is too one dimensional to ever be good without overtuned damage numbers that let her build tank items. Jarvan farms too slow, a lot of people will say well he has great level 2 ganks that are a lot easier to land in solo and you can snowball off of that, I think that is only kind of true this season. There's just so much gold to be had if you play one of the multitude of junglers that can one combo camps at full health, it gives you so much more oppertunity to keep your team in the game if you can just out gold everyone in it while controlling the river because you have so much free time. Sometimes you might get that level 2 gank for your mid lane Ori and it ends up shes not that great so she loses anyway, but it's too late, you already made the choice not to invest in yourself before the game started by picking a slow farmer. You can win in solo with almost anything if you are good enough or improving enough to outplay your current rank, but being able to flash farm jungle camps will let you hit your power spikes and earn objectives for your team on a more consistant basis than hoping your top laner follows up on your flash e>q or even just is able to control his lane with the bonus gold he gets if the gank works. | ||
iCanada
Canada10660 Posts
Has LoL's patcher been kicking the shit out of anyone else's CPU recently? I have an i7-4770 with hyperthreading turned off for work applications, and this Patch is literally maxing out half my cores. o.O Would turning Hyperthreading back on make that much of a difference? Strange. | ||
Jek
Denmark2771 Posts
On August 25 2016 09:54 iCanada wrote: Weird question... Has LoL's patcher been kicking the shit out of anyone else's CPU recently? I have an i7-4770 with hyperthreading turned off for work applications, and this Patch is literally maxing out half my cores. o.O Would turning Hyperthreading back on make that much of a difference? Strange. Dont know if it's the same in NA, but on EUNE there's a notification about patching issues for some players which should be resolved later today. | ||
JonnyLaw
United States3482 Posts
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MuddyJam
535 Posts
On August 25 2016 05:16 Kinie wrote: Personally, the most likely "non-meta" junglers that I see becoming meta are Vi, Diana, and J4, all because they carry the Ori ball really, really well, and her ult buff is pretty huge, especially when you consider she tends to build Athenes/Morellos first item. Having her ult be up for basically every team fight starting at one 20% CDR item by level 6 is insane. For arguement's sake, imagine a team comp of Rumble top, one of these 3 junglers, and Ori mid. The wombo combo is insane. wut, Orianna is not coming back to competitive any time soon so the point it null. In competitive team don't tf very much, and at lvl 6 orianna with no AP is not doing much damage outside of ult. At at high level of play teams won't bunch up very much for those shockwaves. Why would you ever pick orianna over say viktor? lol is more complex than my mashing together wombo combos. | ||
JimmiC
Canada22636 Posts
On August 26 2016 06:58 JonnyLaw wrote: I have a Swain question. On Champion.gg the most common skill order is q > w > e. E only gives dmg now with the flat 205 dmg increase. Maxing W gives a lnger root duration and seems better to me. Any thoughts? I been playing tons of swain and I can confirm q>w>e these days. I also like to start q because I like to get level 2 first and teh bird does good at poke plus killing the minions. I do get e second but I max q then w then E. | ||
kongoline
6318 Posts
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General_Winter
United States719 Posts
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Gahlo
United States34957 Posts
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Jek
Denmark2771 Posts
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JazVM
Germany1196 Posts
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
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