Image of translation of the post on ROX's official Facebook (according to Reddit):
Two things of note:
First, it's sad that no Korean company wants to sponsor this team after a couple of years of fantastic performance on the LCK and international stage.
Second, the fact that Smeb and Peanut are not mentioned in this means they may already have deals in place with other teams, adding to the rumor that Smeb might be coming to NA LCS, and Peanut might get picked up to form another LCK superteam.
On November 25 2016 10:30 Gahlo wrote: If ROX is falling apart, it only shows that League is dying in Korea.
l0l wat? It would probably indicate the difficulty of running a pro team outside of KeSPA but I doubt ROX disbanding means League is dying in Korea. League is as close to dying in 2017 as Overwatch is primed to take over as the biggest eSports game.
On November 25 2016 10:30 Gahlo wrote: If ROX is falling apart, it only shows that League is dying in Korea.
l0l wat? It would probably indicate the difficulty of running a pro team outside of KeSPA but I doubt ROX disbanding means League is dying in Korea. League is as close to dying in 2017 as Overwatch is primed to take over as the biggest eSports game.
If there is nobody is willing to invest in the most popular esport outside of KeSPA orgs, then yes, in my opinion it is dying there. It's not even an Immortal's issue where it's a new org putting things together. All a company had to do was pay to put their name on a top 2 org in the region, they didn't even have to worry about running the team.
On November 28 2016 04:50 dsyxelic wrote: so many of these are so random
thought the TL smeb thing was a fking joke but now that I'm hearing EF Looper and Pob support anything is possible really
is it really that hard for pob to find a mid lane position in NA?
also if the money is the issue dunno why EFX is fine with paying more than other offers for a pob support lol
I guess everyone thinks midlane is the most optimal slot for imports. You can build a team around a star midlaner but you can't do that around a star support. At least not from scratch.
On November 28 2016 04:50 dsyxelic wrote: so many of these are so random
thought the TL smeb thing was a fking joke but now that I'm hearing EF Looper and Pob support anything is possible really
is it really that hard for pob to find a mid lane position in NA?
also if the money is the issue dunno why EFX is fine with paying more than other offers for a pob support lol
I guess everyone thinks midlane is the most optimal slot for imports. You can build a team around a star midlaner but you can't do that around a star support. At least not from scratch.
The game has consistently been in a mid focused meta for years. Mid is allowed to be a heavy impact position at all times and allowed to impact the entire map.
On November 28 2016 04:50 dsyxelic wrote: so many of these are so random
thought the TL smeb thing was a fking joke but now that I'm hearing EF Looper and Pob support anything is possible really
is it really that hard for pob to find a mid lane position in NA?
also if the money is the issue dunno why EFX is fine with paying more than other offers for a pob support lol
I guess everyone thinks midlane is the most optimal slot for imports. You can build a team around a star midlaner but you can't do that around a star support. At least not from scratch.
I understand that logic but the problem is I don't see the consistency in these NA rosters.
I see a 'star' midlaner in maybe 3/10 of the teams.
There is talk that EchoFox may have picked up Looper for Top, Santorin for Jungle, and Pobelter for Support?
Pob for support is weird as hell to me. I'd ditch Froggen for Pob, then get another support personally. I think Forggen needs to carry way harder for the greedy low impact game he plays, and usually he doesn't. Hence why he always "wins lane" but both his other lanes get shit stomped.
On November 28 2016 09:38 iCanada wrote: There is talk that EchoFox may have picked up Looper for Top, Santorin for Jungle, and Pobelter for Support?
Pob for support is weird as hell to me. I'd ditch Froggen for Pob, then get another support personally. I think Forggen needs to carry way harder for the greedy low impact game he plays, and usually he doesn't. Hence why he always "wins lane" but both his other lanes get shit stomped.
Agree. Froggen is reaching Legacy, keeping the name for the brand status levels of mediocrity.
On November 28 2016 09:38 iCanada wrote: There is talk that EchoFox may have picked up Looper for Top, Santorin for Jungle, and Pobelter for Support?
Pob for support is weird as hell to me. I'd ditch Froggen for Pob, then get another support personally. I think Forggen needs to carry way harder for the greedy low impact game he plays, and usually he doesn't. Hence why he always "wins lane" but both his other lanes get shit stomped.
Seems bizarre; you have one of the best non-import midlaners and you move him to support? TL probably needs a midlaner of pob's quality ... assuming he has moved on from hating Steve.
On November 28 2016 09:38 iCanada wrote: There is talk that EchoFox may have picked up Looper for Top, Santorin for Jungle, and Pobelter for Support?
Pob for support is weird as hell to me. I'd ditch Froggen for Pob, then get another support personally. I think Forggen needs to carry way harder for the greedy low impact game he plays, and usually he doesn't. Hence why he always "wins lane" but both his other lanes get shit stomped.
Seems bizarre; you have one of the best non-import midlaners and you move him to support? TL probably needs a midlaner of pob's quality ... assuming he has moved on from hating Steve.
Pob is obv most comfortable as Mid but if he's willing to move to Support, that indicates to me either EF is pitching him the best offer he's getting for 2017 and/or he feels comfortable with the players/staff. After what Steve did to Pobelter on Curse, I highly doubt he's over it. If anything, it's pretty schadenfreude that TL could use a quality Mid and Pob gets to say no. lul
On November 28 2016 09:38 iCanada wrote: There is talk that EchoFox may have picked up Looper for Top, Santorin for Jungle, and Pobelter for Support?
Pob for support is weird as hell to me. I'd ditch Froggen for Pob, then get another support personally. I think Forggen needs to carry way harder for the greedy low impact game he plays, and usually he doesn't. Hence why he always "wins lane" but both his other lanes get shit stomped.
Agree. Froggen is reaching Legacy, keeping the name for the brand status levels of mediocrity.
Froggen is basically in the same category for me as Flame. Players touted as exceptional except the only thing they end up getting is some nice personal stats postgame but fail to convert those nice KDA/CS into Ws.
SKT keep their core, so they should still be a contender next season. I imagine they'll need to upgrade blank eventually, no clue who they'll look for as a top laner if KT Smeb if true.
I'm hopeful for SKT Peanut but idk who SKT can get for Top though. ssumday seems ok but it's more or less a sidegrade from Duke zz. Makes me wonder if Duke himself pulled a MaRin, which seems fair.
How KT's business is done: KT: You! Stay with me! Score: NOOOOOOOOOOO! KT: We promise you. Our next bot lane is Deft and Mata. Score: Alright, I'll stay.
Next day KT contacts Deft and Mata. KT: Please join us. D&M: NOPE. KT: Hey, our TOP is Smeb and MID is Pawn! D&M: YEP.
Next day KT contacts Smeb. KT: Come with us! Smeb: Not really. KT: We have Score, Deft and Mata. Smeb: Brilliant!
On November 29 2016 21:48 Gahlo wrote: From reddit:
How KT's business is done: KT: You! Stay with me! Score: NOOOOOOOOOOO! KT: We promise you. Our next bot lane is Deft and Mata. Score: Alright, I'll stay.
Next day KT contacts Deft and Mata. KT: Please join us. D&M: NOPE. KT: Hey, our TOP is Smeb and MID is Pawn! D&M: YEP.
Next day KT contacts Smeb. KT: Come with us! Smeb: Not really. KT: We have Score, Deft and Mata. Smeb: Brilliant!
That is some serious balling to work it out that way.
Is there like a comprehensive list of all of the BW folks involved in League? I remember Reach and Yellow were involved in various League teams.
Professional League of Legends players who came from Brood War
1) Ggoong (ZTR Esports): Went by his original alias of Grape, and played protoss for Samsung Khan at the height of his Brood War career. The only League of Legends professional to achieve anything of note during his Brood War days (he managed to reach the round of eight in an individual league once).
2) Watch (ZTR Esports): Went by his original alias of Tazza, and played protoss for OGN Sparkyz. Was a bottom of the barrel professional who managed a one single victory that was a KeSPA officiated match in his entire career (it was an upset win versus Bisu).
3) Duke (ex-SK Telecom T1): Went by his original alias of Klaus, and played protoss. Was a bottom of the barrel professional who didn't even get to have his debut.
4) Coco (Longzhu gaming): Went by his original alias of Arista, and played zerg. Was a bottom of the barrel professional who didn't even get to have his debut.
League of Legends personalities/coaches/commentators who came from Brood War
1) iloveoov (Afreeca Freecs coach): Five time champion. One of the bonjwas of Brood War.
2) Reach (CJ Entus coach): One time champion. One of the greatest protoss players of all time.
3) DoGGi (Samsung Galaxy coach): A terran player who played for Samsung Khan, he managed a round of eight appearance in an individual league.
4) [n2]Rookie (OGN commentator): An old school terran player with an aggressive style who peaked at a round of eight appearance in an individual league. One of the leading figures of the Korean League of Legends scene.
5) nO.1 (SPOTV commentator): An old school terran player with a defensive style who peaked at a round of 16 appearance in an individual league.
6) MC (Kongdoo Monster coach): A bottom of the barrel protoss player for MBC Game Hero who managed a single KeSPA officiated win in his entire career. More famous for his Starcraft 2 exploits.
There are others who dabbled in their attempts at being a professional player (such as Brave), or coaching (such as YellOw, firebathero, Horang2), or media personalities (such as Nal_rA, GARIMTO). But I don't think they are currently active in the scene.
On December 01 2016 01:58 Slusher wrote: Mc is also a coach for kongdoo not sure what his be Id was but I think he was a low tier pro
Good call, forgot about suicide toss. Will add to the list. As for calls for Park Yong Woon to be added to the list, he was never a professional Brood War player, and is not currently working for Newbee.
Well, there goes SKT's one real weakness, all they need now is a top laner that won't feed a million kills to the enemy top/jungler, and SKT should be clear favorites for 2017 Worlds once again (barring some huge meta shift where top lane carries become relevant again).
Well, there goes SKT's one real weakness, all they need now is a top laner that won't feed a million kills to the enemy top/jungler, and SKT should be clear favorites for 2017 Worlds once again (barring some huge meta shift where top lane carries become relevant again).
Smeb is on KT, Duke left, I doubt Samsung is going to let them take CuVee, Marin is on LGD. That writes off pretty much all the top Korean top laners outside of Ssumday, who has issues against all of those top laners.
Ssumday had issues against these top laners knowing that he was pretty much the one true carry of KT for most of his career. That forces you to play differently. Whether he can unlearn these habits is another thing, but i wouldn't rule him out so easily.
They must've seen some things they liked. The only thing I can imagine is that they want to play like ROX early 2016, hyperaggressive and in your face. Except i dont think wolf is good enough to facilitate that. Whatever, we'll see.
maybe huni was super cheap or something? he was good but not top tier last season (hauntzer and impact were both quite good), and his unique ability to tilt off the face of the earth is... worrying.
but skt obviously held extensive tryouts with many players if not all top tier top laners and they saw something that could work.
kkoma could work for this guy. first season with deilor worked pretty well even if huni was still inferior to smeb/marin. at least we know for sure that kkoma would never let huni near top lucian with a 10 foot pole. huni's obviously talented so I have some concerns but should be ok.
my expectations are that he'll be a similar laner to duke, worse on tanks, but better at TPing (huni's flanks are generally pretty gud and at least better than duke was before joining skt lol)
I also feel like him and peanut will get along quite well lol
I expect Huni to not carry, but to put alot of pressure and attention on top. This will in turn free up Peanut, Faker and Wolf to take over the rest of the map. However, this is just a simple analysis of I think Huni should be capable of, if he doesn't die in dumbass 1v1s.
but skt obviously held extensive tryouts with many players if not all top tier top laners and they saw something that could work.
kkoma could work for this guy. first season with deilor worked pretty well even if huni was still inferior to smeb/marin. at least we know for sure that kkoma would never let huni near top lucian with a 10 foot pole. huni's obviously talented so I have some concerns but should be ok.
my expectations are that he'll be a similar laner to duke, worse on tanks, but better at TPing (huni's flanks are generally pretty gud and at least better than duke was before joining skt lol)
I also feel like him and peanut will get along quite well lol
So you think his upside is being as good as Ssumday?
On December 02 2016 07:32 Sent. wrote: Huni is very popular in the West maybe it's a PR stunt and they'll replace him with someone better in the summer seaosn. /tinfoil
With someone like Huni, it's not unreasonable to take a flyer on Huni for Spring, knowing that if he really crashes and burns you have time to find someone else for Summer. But clearly kkoma thinks that Huni has a very high ceiling, such that if he does well he's going to do really well.
but skt obviously held extensive tryouts with many players if not all top tier top laners and they saw something that could work.
kkoma could work for this guy. first season with deilor worked pretty well even if huni was still inferior to smeb/marin. at least we know for sure that kkoma would never let huni near top lucian with a 10 foot pole. huni's obviously talented so I have some concerns but should be ok.
my expectations are that he'll be a similar laner to duke, worse on tanks, but better at TPing (huni's flanks are generally pretty gud and at least better than duke was before joining skt lol)
I also feel like him and peanut will get along quite well lol
So you think his upside is being as good as Ssumday?
yeah something like ssumday level would be a positive outcome. his ceiling is a bit higher I believe but I'm not expecting him to get there. right now I'm expecting slightly worse than duke. negative outcome would be him being like 5th/6th best top in LCK. worst case scenario for me is him being like bottom 3. so yeah my assumption right now is top 4-5ish. If he was in last LCK I would assume he would be worse than smeb, duke, cuvee, ssumday and better than the others.
On December 02 2016 08:59 ticklishmusic wrote: are korean tops just not that great? i dont see how huni is better than even average there based on his LCS performances
its the opposite really
the biggest difference in skill for roles internationally have been top and jungle for a while
especially top for like.. years
in both quantity and quality korean tops have byfar'd other regions lol
It's not farfetched that Huni impressed or something. Huni's ceiling is still unknown (he could become a god with KR coaching etc. or not improve dramatically)
On December 02 2016 08:59 ticklishmusic wrote: are korean tops just not that great? i dont see how huni is better than even average there based on his LCS performances
its the opposite really
the biggest difference in skill for roles internationally have been top and jungle for a while
especially top for like.. years
in both quantity and quality korean tops have byfar'd other regions lol
yeah thats what i thought... which is why its weird they'd pick some dude who is def not the best top in even NA. like, huni is a good player obviously, but unless he's working for free (i bet quite a few players would play for SKT for free actually) idk why'd they choose him over someone else.
on another note, seems like there's some rumors about pray possibly maybe considering going to to tsm
On December 02 2016 14:01 MooMooMugi wrote: Seems like Pobelter is gunna stay to IMT after that dumb leak and might have bengi and duke on his team LOL
On December 02 2016 08:59 ticklishmusic wrote: are korean tops just not that great? i dont see how huni is better than even average there based on his LCS performances
its the opposite really
the biggest difference in skill for roles internationally have been top and jungle for a while
especially top for like.. years
in both quantity and quality korean tops have byfar'd other regions lol
yeah thats what i thought... which is why its weird they'd pick some dude who is def not the best top in even NA. like, huni is a good player obviously, but unless he's working for free (i bet quite a few players would play for SKT for free actually) idk why'd they choose him over someone else.
on another note, seems like there's some rumors about pray possibly maybe considering going to to tsm
they're definitely looking at his ceiling
also I think they were looking at the more aggressive/strong laning tops to pair with peanut. plus banking on the coaching.
huni definitely had his issues but his time on IMT isn't really reflective of his actual skill imo because of how badly suited the coaching was for him. huni on fnc with deilor is more representative of what huni can do with a well suited coach like deilor/kkoma.
the only people I can think of (that were looking for a team) I would have taken or potentially taken over huni are ssumday, looper, (keep)duke. can't think of any others. seems reasonable when you have to factor in cost. I'm pretty sure huni took a paycut here and was cheaper than those guys.
On December 02 2016 08:59 ticklishmusic wrote: are korean tops just not that great? i dont see how huni is better than even average there based on his LCS performances
its the opposite really
the biggest difference in skill for roles internationally have been top and jungle for a while
especially top for like.. years
in both quantity and quality korean tops have byfar'd other regions lol
yeah thats what i thought... which is why its weird they'd pick some dude who is def not the best top in even NA. like, huni is a good player obviously, but unless he's working for free (i bet quite a few players would play for SKT for free actually) idk why'd they choose him over someone else.
on another note, seems like there's some rumors about pray possibly maybe considering going to to tsm
they're definitely looking at his ceiling
also I think they were looking at the more aggressive/strong laning tops to pair with peanut. plus banking on the coaching.
huni definitely had his issues but his time on IMT isn't really reflective of his actual skill imo because of how badly suited the coaching was for him. huni on fnc with deilor is more representative of what huni can do with a well suited coach like deilor/kkoma.
the only people I can think of (that were looking for a team) I would have taken or potentially taken over huni are ssumday, looper, (keep)duke. can't think of any others. seems reasonable when you have to factor in cost. I'm pretty sure huni took a paycut here and was cheaper than those guys.
i agree he looked pretty good on FNC, but that was a looooong time ago and FNC was stomping the rest of EU. i also agree IMT probably had garbage coaching (like what coach lets him get away with top lucian). i guess ultimately they must think they see a much higher ceiling than me - my view is that he becomes a pretty average top that's kind of aggressive, but only after he sorts out his tilting and coaching issues. huni might be more of a known quantity so this is kinda like some NBA team sgning someone a veteran's minimum, but there's gotta be a bunch of talented soloQ/ amateur players in korea, the talent pool can't be that empty can it?
On December 02 2016 08:59 ticklishmusic wrote: are korean tops just not that great? i dont see how huni is better than even average there based on his LCS performances
its the opposite really
the biggest difference in skill for roles internationally have been top and jungle for a while
especially top for like.. years
in both quantity and quality korean tops have byfar'd other regions lol
yeah thats what i thought... which is why its weird they'd pick some dude who is def not the best top in even NA. like, huni is a good player obviously, but unless he's working for free (i bet quite a few players would play for SKT for free actually) idk why'd they choose him over someone else.
on another note, seems like there's some rumors about pray possibly maybe considering going to to tsm
they're definitely looking at his ceiling
also I think they were looking at the more aggressive/strong laning tops to pair with peanut. plus banking on the coaching.
huni definitely had his issues but his time on IMT isn't really reflective of his actual skill imo because of how badly suited the coaching was for him. huni on fnc with deilor is more representative of what huni can do with a well suited coach like deilor/kkoma.
the only people I can think of (that were looking for a team) I would have taken or potentially taken over huni are ssumday, looper, (keep)duke. can't think of any others. seems reasonable when you have to factor in cost. I'm pretty sure huni took a paycut here and was cheaper than those guys.
i agree he looked pretty good on FNC, but that was a looooong time ago and FNC was stomping the rest of EU. i also agree IMT probably had garbage coaching (like what coach lets him get away with top lucian). i guess ultimately they must think they see a much higher ceiling than me - my view is that he becomes a pretty average top that's kind of aggressive, but only after he sorts out his tilting and coaching issues. huni might be more of a known quantity so this is kinda like some NBA team sgning someone a veteran's minimum, but there's gotta be a bunch of talented soloQ/ amateur players in korea, the talent pool can't be that empty can it?
yeah im not comparing to EU tops, he looked stronger than scrubs but below the top tier ones like marin/smeb/ssumday at worlds. so he was somewhere in between. with kkoma and skt buff it wouldnt be farfetched for him to reach around that level.
well they did get a really good young soloq top, Profit. the two will prob compete for the job so its not like they don't have a backup plan.
Teams should be smart and work this kind of stuff into their contracts. Instead of paying $100, agree to pay $80, with a $30 bonus for not getting in trouble with Riot, and if you do get in trouble with Riot, have to pay the $80 back to the team.
Adrian speaks Chinese not English right? Its a pretty solid roster if Zig can live up to his potential. Wether or not it can go top half of NA I am not sure about yet.
On December 04 2016 18:05 Wita wrote: Adrian speaks Chinese not English right? Its a pretty solid roster if Zig can live up to his potential. Wether or not it can go top half of NA I am not sure about yet.
Adrian is an American, pretty sure he speaks English.
On December 04 2016 18:05 Wita wrote: Adrian speaks Chinese not English right? Its a pretty solid roster if Zig can live up to his potential. Wether or not it can go top half of NA I am not sure about yet.
Adrian is an American, pretty sure he speaks English.
Was supposed to write Korean instead of English. ffs.
On December 04 2016 18:05 Wita wrote: Adrian speaks Chinese not English right? Its a pretty solid roster if Zig can live up to his potential. Wether or not it can go top half of NA I am not sure about yet.
Adrian is an American, pretty sure he speaks English.
Was supposed to write Korean instead of English. ffs.
dunno how well he learned (if he learned) chinese from his parents but he's of chinese descent not korean
On December 05 2016 13:39 Faeny wrote: TL management never ceases to amaze me. Well, at least they cashed out.
Well we'll have the best Jungler and ADC in the league in spring by the looks of it. Adrian might be better than Matt, but Matt-Piglett will still be the best bot lane in spring (and importantly, will be one of the experienced bot lanes coming into the season). I don't think spending import slots on best player in the region for that role is a poor use of an import slot, so given that you need to fill mid and top with NA residents. If you look over the table in the first post you'll see that basically every midlaner except Pobelter is an import (and Bjerg but TSM got lucky with the grandfathering there). Reports are that an offer to Pobelter was made, who rejected it (for probably obvious reasons) so then you go to the second tier of midlaners of which goldenglue has experience with the team already (piglet/dlim) and has shown positive signs in the last year. Not much to lose by taking on a shot on him since you can't buy a better player in that position without importing. Similar story for top lane, what resident top laner is better than Lourlo? He's matched up favorably with Hauntzer in the past, we know he's better than Zig (since we had that choice in Summer)... looking over the list you have Darshan who fluctuates with the meta (like Lourlo) or Seraph. I don't know, looking at that list I don't think you're getting much mileage out of swapping Lourlo for someone else (if that opportunity even presented itself).
Basically, if you think we spent the import slots wrong then sure our roster sucks. But if you like how the import slots were spent then I think we're in with a shot.
On December 05 2016 13:39 Faeny wrote: TL management never ceases to amaze me. Well, at least they cashed out.
Well we'll have the best Jungler and ADC in the league in spring by the looks of it. Adrian might be better than Matt, but Matt-Piglett will still be the best bot lane in spring (and importantly, will be one of the experienced bot lanes coming into the season). I don't think spending import slots on best player in the region for that role is a poor use of an import slot, so given that you need to fill mid and top with NA residents. If you look over the table in the first post you'll see that basically every midlaner except Pobelter is an import (and Bjerg but TSM got lucky with the grandfathering there). Reports are that an offer to Pobelter was made, who rejected it (for probably obvious reasons) so then you go to the second tier of midlaners of which goldenglue has experience with the team already (piglet/dlim) and has shown positive signs in the last year. Not much to lose by taking on a shot on him since you can't buy a better player in that position without importing. Similar story for top lane, what resident top laner is better than Lourlo? He's matched up favorably with Hauntzer in the past, we know he's better than Zig (since we had that choice in Summer)... looking over the list you have Darshan who fluctuates with the meta (like Lourlo) or Seraph. I don't know, looking at that list I don't think you're getting much mileage out of swapping Lourlo for someone else (if that opportunity even presented itself).
Basically, if you think we spent the import slots wrong then sure our roster sucks. But if you like how the import slots were spent then I think we're in with a shot.
I would hold off on saying RO and Piglet are the best jungler and adc in the league until other rosters are announced. I wouldn't say Piglet is better than Arrow either.
Saying Zion and Lourlo fluctuate with the meta is putting it in the nicest possible terms.
Considering how Pobelter quit Curse the last time, I'm not surprised if he hates it, lol.
A realistic goal for Liquid is to make playoffs, this roster isn't capable of anything higher than that. Sucks to be Reignover in that kind of situation, but at least he's going to get paid good moneys for trying to achieve that goal.
On December 05 2016 13:39 Faeny wrote: TL management never ceases to amaze me. Well, at least they cashed out.
Well we'll have the best Jungler and ADC in the league in spring by the looks of it. Adrian might be better than Matt, but Matt-Piglett will still be the best bot lane in spring (and importantly, will be one of the experienced bot lanes coming into the season). I don't think spending import slots on best player in the region for that role is a poor use of an import slot, so given that you need to fill mid and top with NA residents. If you look over the table in the first post you'll see that basically every midlaner except Pobelter is an import (and Bjerg but TSM got lucky with the grandfathering there). Reports are that an offer to Pobelter was made, who rejected it (for probably obvious reasons) so then you go to the second tier of midlaners of which goldenglue has experience with the team already (piglet/dlim) and has shown positive signs in the last year. Not much to lose by taking on a shot on him since you can't buy a better player in that position without importing. Similar story for top lane, what resident top laner is better than Lourlo? He's matched up favorably with Hauntzer in the past, we know he's better than Zig (since we had that choice in Summer)... looking over the list you have Darshan who fluctuates with the meta (like Lourlo) or Seraph. I don't know, looking at that list I don't think you're getting much mileage out of swapping Lourlo for someone else (if that opportunity even presented itself).
Basically, if you think we spent the import slots wrong then sure our roster sucks. But if you like how the import slots were spent then I think we're in with a shot.
I would hold off on saying RO and Piglet are the best jungler and adc in the league until other rosters are announced. I wouldn't say Piglet is better than Arrow either.
Saying Zion and Lourlo fluctuate with the meta is putting it in the nicest possible terms.
are you awaiting dandy in NA? ;D but real, which other better junglers would come to NA? can't think of any right now that isn't on a team already
as for adc piglet definitely has the advantage early on because he's been with TL for a while now and matt for over a split.
I think it's fair to assume they are the best at their positon for the beginning of the season, with the rest of the season being up for grabs.
On December 06 2016 00:12 JimmiC wrote: For someone who didnt follow the lcs for long what is the reason poebelter hates TL?
pobelter was on curse (former TL) he was still in high school then, and it was a known thing that he had to go to school during the day and then go to teamhouse after Liquid (TL/curse owner) announced the roster of voyboy, iwd, pobelter, aphro(adc), and zekent i believe. Liquid then changed his mind about pobelter going to school not being a problem and kicked pobelter. pobelter was rightfully pretty pissed especially when he had been with the org for a while at this point. aphro left because of this too.
someone correct me if I'm wrong, I'm pretty sure this is how it went
anyways overall I'm somewhat satisfied with the offseason. TL tried to get the right people, just didn't work out unlucky. I also think reignover is the best possible person you can find in NA LCS to pair with piglet.
they changed their minds and kicked him after less than a week, which was pretty ridiculous and unprofessional... i think aphro decided he didn't want to be on a team like that and peaced out as well
If I remember correctly, wasn't Pobelter also kicked by Curse mere days before the roster lock deadline, making it very difficult for him to find a team on his own terms?
On December 05 2016 13:39 Faeny wrote: TL management never ceases to amaze me. Well, at least they cashed out.
Well we'll have the best Jungler and ADC in the league in spring by the looks of it. Adrian might be better than Matt, but Matt-Piglett will still be the best bot lane in spring (and importantly, will be one of the experienced bot lanes coming into the season). I don't think spending import slots on best player in the region for that role is a poor use of an import slot, so given that you need to fill mid and top with NA residents. If you look over the table in the first post you'll see that basically every midlaner except Pobelter is an import (and Bjerg but TSM got lucky with the grandfathering there). Reports are that an offer to Pobelter was made, who rejected it (for probably obvious reasons) so then you go to the second tier of midlaners of which goldenglue has experience with the team already (piglet/dlim) and has shown positive signs in the last year. Not much to lose by taking on a shot on him since you can't buy a better player in that position without importing. Similar story for top lane, what resident top laner is better than Lourlo? He's matched up favorably with Hauntzer in the past, we know he's better than Zig (since we had that choice in Summer)... looking over the list you have Darshan who fluctuates with the meta (like Lourlo) or Seraph. I don't know, looking at that list I don't think you're getting much mileage out of swapping Lourlo for someone else (if that opportunity even presented itself).
Basically, if you think we spent the import slots wrong then sure our roster sucks. But if you like how the import slots were spent then I think we're in with a shot.
I would hold off on saying RO and Piglet are the best jungler and adc in the league until other rosters are announced. I wouldn't say Piglet is better than Arrow either.
Saying Zion and Lourlo fluctuate with the meta is putting it in the nicest possible terms.
are you awaiting dandy in NA? ;D but real, which other better junglers would come to NA? can't think of any right now that isn't on a team already
as for adc piglet definitely has the advantage early on because he's been with TL for a while now and matt for over a split.
I think it's fair to assume they are the best at their positon for the beginning of the season, with the rest of the season being up for grabs.
On December 06 2016 00:12 JimmiC wrote: For someone who didnt follow the lcs for long what is the reason poebelter hates TL?
anyways overall I'm somewhat satisfied with the offseason. TL tried to get the right people, just didn't work out unlucky. I also think reignover is the best possible person you can find in NA LCS to pair with piglet.
To me the question now is does TL gain more from moving from Dardoch to Reignover than they lose from moving from Fenix to Goldenglue? At first I would have said they lost more than they gain, but then I start to factor in their move to get Dlim as coach. To me, this guy has some talent. I say this not only due to how TLAcademy looked, but just look at this past ScoutingGrounds session. Team Ocean looked a lot more cleaner than I was expecting from a bunch of solo queue players in that amount of time. Dlim has a lot of time to groom TL and I see them having a decent chance of getting a playoff birth if not making a deep run in it.
On December 06 2016 09:29 Faeny wrote: If I remember correctly, wasn't Pobelter also kicked by Curse mere days before the roster lock deadline, making it very difficult for him to find a team on his own terms?
Yes, this was also a major issue. Not only did Liquid112 give Pobelter the boot but there was so little time for Pob to find a new team and negotiate terms before the deadline.
Just to confirm since I don't speak KR, did fomos mention Easyhoon crying in the basement or is that your addition?
Nah, I was kidding. Was joking on the rumor that Easyhoon couldn't get Pray or Bang to join Vici Gaming and wanted to leave with Longzhu touted as a possible team that he could join.
Gotta wonder who IMT which support they choose to fill out their roster. They still have an import slot so I wonder if we'll see an import support? Aren't they in Korea right now?
On December 08 2016 03:44 Plexa wrote: Gotta wonder who IMT which support they choose to fill out their roster. They still have an import slot so I wonder if we'll see an import support? Aren't they in Korea right now?
I mean I point to msi (and to a lesser extent worlds) where he got pretty much dumpstered in lane every game but had really large late game impact and I think exactly what I'd (reasonably)want from a resident slot
On December 08 2016 08:03 dsyxelic wrote: LOL if you told me 2 seasons ago we'd have dig ssumday and dig chaser haha
i know nba money but still pretty funny how things end up
also apparently IMT support will be kasing according to reddit detectives who looked through replays, opgg, runes, etc.
Imagine being told that CoreJJ would come within a game of winning worlds and that the year after Ssumday will go to Dignitas. People would think you flat out lost your mind.
Dig could potentially have a sick roster if they pick up the right ADC. Chaser and Ssumday were at one point the top of their roles so I still have fairytale expectations for them
On December 08 2016 08:42 MooMooMugi wrote: Dig could potentially have a sick roster if they pick up the right ADC. Chaser and Ssumday were at one point the top of their roles so I still have fairytale expectations for them
Lod on dig would round out the roster decently. Could potentially see a semis run if things go right. Cant see them winning anything tho. Best dig roster for sure tho (as far as I remember at least).
Im wondering whats going on with c9c. Literally 0 news or rumors
wonder how tsm will do next split. wt is the only change, feels like a downgrade (esp with all the free agents they could have potentially picked up) but even with a meh ad they could do pretty good. imt managed to, anyways.
Lod on dig would round out the roster decently. Could potentially see a semis run if things go right. Cant see them winning anything tho. Best dig roster for sure tho (as far as I remember at least).
Im wondering whats going on with c9c. Literally 0 news or rumors
We haven't had any C9 or CLG rumors at all unless I'm misremembering. Hell wasn't today the first day we heard about NV?
With the money being slung around, I wouldn't be surprised to see C9 or CLG pick up an import or two. Then there is also C9C and NV, which have to feel pressured to spend some money to not get relegated.
Some big names out there still; Bengi, Pray, Duke, Easyhoon, Marin, Dandy... I am sure there are a few more.
Holy moly. NA rolling up some dumptrucks full of money.
Also, seems like IMT is signing Kasing. Kasing is in Korea right now and is duoing hard with Massacre on Riot accounts.
TSM ought to bring in some minority investors or something. There's big money out there looking to get into esports, and a investment in a well-known brand with proven leadership like Regi seems like a better move than buying a LCS slot and having to figure things out yourself.
I'm just saying with overwatch being confirmed bidding per slot and riot refusing to confirm franchise opportunities to legacy teams. I personally wonder how much a current slot really matters.
about 2.5 million apparently. I think you would be silly to think an organization that big and wealthy didn't do there due diligence with their lawyers accountants and so on.
On December 09 2016 11:27 ticklishmusic wrote: TSM ought to bring in some minority investors or something. There's big money out there looking to get into esports, and a investment in a well-known brand with proven leadership like Regi seems like a better move than buying a LCS slot and having to figure things out yourself.
They're sponsored by Geico, currently.
On December 09 2016 12:08 JimmiC wrote: Riot has to be absolutely pumped about NBA ownership involvement. It legitimizes it so much.
On December 09 2016 11:27 ticklishmusic wrote: TSM ought to bring in some minority investors or something. There's big money out there looking to get into esports, and a investment in a well-known brand with proven leadership like Regi seems like a better move than buying a LCS slot and having to figure things out yourself.
On December 09 2016 11:27 ticklishmusic wrote: TSM ought to bring in some minority investors or something. There's big money out there looking to get into esports, and a investment in a well-known brand with proven leadership like Regi seems like a better move than buying a LCS slot and having to figure things out yourself.
They're sponsored by Geico, currently.
On December 09 2016 12:08 JimmiC wrote: Riot has to be absolutely pumped about NBA ownership involvement. It legitimizes it so much.
Not to mention selling streaming right to MLB.
sponsor =/= equity investment
I'm not sure Regi is willing to give up part of his empire and I think he has a lot more money than people realize.
On December 09 2016 11:27 ticklishmusic wrote: TSM ought to bring in some minority investors or something. There's big money out there looking to get into esports, and a investment in a well-known brand with proven leadership like Regi seems like a better move than buying a LCS slot and having to figure things out yourself.
They're sponsored by Geico, currently.
On December 09 2016 12:08 JimmiC wrote: Riot has to be absolutely pumped about NBA ownership involvement. It legitimizes it so much.
Not to mention selling streaming right to MLB.
sponsor =/= equity investment
I'm not sure Regi is willing to give up part of his empire and I think he has a lot more money than people realize.
i'd guess regi has a profit in the single millions a year or something.
im just confused by why tsm went with wildturtle. if cost isnt an issue, it must be because the team feels REALLY good about wt, like the way skt t1 felt about huni or something. i think huni was slightly above average in NA and will be mediocre-ish in KR, but hey.
there's definitely a big appeal in being a sole owner, but bringing in some well-connected media professional as a minority investor can open up a lot of doors. plus, if the guy owns a piece he'll also be incentivized to work hard and grow tsm so his piece becomes worth more. moreover, it would be the guy essentially paying regi for the privilege of helping regi instead of regi paying him to help.
I think wt is fine (as spring adc), dunno what the fuss is about.
The tsm roster with wt is still strong enough to win spring and hes basically a placeholder for doublelift or someone else anyways. And if wt turns out to redeem himself as a top adc its a win for tsm as well. So honestly its a win win scenario. Cheap guy who is 0 risk (known quantity, good teammate, familiar with org, etc) and still in good place to collect reasonable points for summer/worlds. Its a very logical move by regi.
On December 09 2016 15:08 dsyxelic wrote: I think wt is fine (as spring adc), dunno what the fuss is about.
The tsm roster with wt is still strong enough to win spring and hes basically a placeholder for doublelift or someone else anyways. And if wt turns out to redeem himself as a top adc its a win for tsm as well. So honestly its a win win scenario. Cheap guy who is 0 risk (known quantity, good teammate, familiar with org, etc) and still in good place to collect reasonable points for summer/worlds. Its a very logical move by regi.
The only thing that has me concerned about the WT signing, assuming DL steps back in for the Summer or they can find another player of his caliber or better, is that Hauntzer is now forced to be the 2nd carry of the team and top lane in NA is going to be the hardest it's ever been with all the KR imports coming in.
If some one is looking for an idea on a article to write I would be interested in reading a "power ranking" for each regions teams after all the moves.
On December 16 2016 20:09 Wita wrote: I dont know how you can be surprised by Ssumday and Chaser going to Dig. It has been public knowledge for like a week or so by now.
Well people managed to not know TLs roster and that had been known for a month :D
Anyone else have thescore esports app? It has a free agent tracker and decent articles. I've just had it a week but it's pretty good. I like there sports app and it seems similar
That looks like it might lengthen the process. I was hoping at least some of the extra banns would be simulatianous. So risk of wasting bans if both teams ban same thing, but no extra time in champ select.
TBH being a fan of both Dota and league the extra draft complexity is worth the time. Although the way hero skill sets change the game feels stronger in dota so that might be a part of it too.
I was half expecting this to be the announcement just because of the way the news of them leaving the Freeks was worded, SOmething about it seemed to me like the players planned to stick together.
Some players are great in soloq and cant make the transition, some players who might not be rank1 potential in soloq can turn into good players on the LCS stage.
On January 03 2017 03:00 chipmonklord17 wrote: how have we had zero information on Origen? No roster rumor, no spot selling rumors. Just nothing at all
On January 03 2017 03:00 chipmonklord17 wrote: how have we had zero information on Origen? No roster rumor, no spot selling rumors. Just nothing at all
But there is more: in the coming days, we will unveil the final member of the team’s staff, and we can guarantee that the announcement will make waves in the scene.
He is pretty well known in the western sc2 scene because he was part of a western team for a long time. Which is apparently why he was picked, Korean pro gamer with experience living in Europe and speaking English. So his job will be to take care of H2k's 2 Koreans including translating. Also a decent League player apparently (Master).