With the introduction of dynamic queue, we alienated a portion of League’s passionate player-base who believe a ranked competitive experience should be limited to a solo (or duo) endeavor. We agree dynamic queue standings don’t reflect pure individual skill as well as a solo ladder, but they also don’t inhibit competitive team experiences, and that’s a trade-off we want to make. After considering all possible options and assessing the gains (and losses) of dynamic queue over the last five months, we've made the decision to not bring back solo queue.
Riot confirms no more solo queue.
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Faeny
647 Posts
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Zess
Adun Toridas!9144 Posts
The main issues that still sucks is that they have zero solutions for high elo in terms of getting matches made because that was the one place where Ranked 5s actually served a purpose (everywhere else Ranked 5s is basically a shitty version of "play ranked with friends in Dynamic Q"). Also autofill sucks because I already get my secondary way more and I suspect I'm going to get my primary even less now with secondary + autofill. Since I play in More Than Enough People elo I'd happily trade an extra 3-4 min wait time to actually play what I set, and alternatively having Fill be more than just Support would be nice too. | ||
yamato77
11589 Posts
I don't know why they would implement autofill for their general playerbase when queue times can't have been that ridiculous. I suppose it's a way to force a portion of your playerbase onto other roles to more evenly distribute role selection in the queue. It sort of exposes the naive anecdotal myth that there are plenty of support mains to fill in games. Unfortunately it also undermines the point of role selection in the first place. | ||
Karis Vas Ryaar
United States4396 Posts
On June 01 2016 09:18 Zess wrote: I think we all knew it was coming tbh. The main issues that still sucks is that they have zero solutions for high elo in terms of getting matches made because that was the one place where Ranked 5s actually served a purpose (everywhere else Ranked 5s is basically a shitty version of "play ranked with friends in Dynamic Q"). Also autofill sucks because I already get my secondary way more and I suspect I'm going to get my primary even less now with secondary + autofill. Since I play in More Than Enough People elo I'd happily trade an extra 3-4 min wait time to actually play what I set, and alternatively having Fill be more than just Support would be nice too. one thing I'll add is that this problem is not unique to Riot. although the queue by position is more complicated. Halo 5 has had serious problems with getting games for the highest ranked players and a bunch of other games have too. I like dynamic queue more then solo probably and it doesn't really make sense to have 2 ranked formats that are competing with each other. Curious how they try to solve it and how well it works. | ||
Sent.
Poland8967 Posts
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zer0das
United States8519 Posts
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
On June 01 2016 11:54 Karis Vas Ryaar wrote: one thing I'll add is that this problem is not unique to Riot. although the queue by position is more complicated. Halo 5 has had serious problems with getting games for the highest ranked players and a bunch of other games have too. I like dynamic queue more then solo probably and it doesn't really make sense to have 2 ranked formats that are competing with each other. Curious how they try to solve it and how well it works. As Yamato said generally in other games people form Inhouse leagues externally that deals with high level games. CSGO has Faceit/ESEA and a host of small amateur level cup competition for people to play in as teams. I think dota has similar but I haven't really been part of the scene for awhile, when I used to play we'd just use one big irc channel and there was that ixmike league thing. For some reason league hasn't seemed to bother with these things. It always seemed weird to me how there was so much talk about fostering talent but yet lacked these systems which do just that. Anyway Riot as usual seems too stubborn to admit fault and instead keep coming up with increasingly worse solutions that cause more problems than just changing back their system. | ||
Fildun
Netherlands4118 Posts
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DarkCore
Germany4194 Posts
Maybe its time to rework support into something thats actually fun to play for more than 10% of the playerbase Support had a rework when they removed the passive gold generation items and added nice support items. Also, the ward items and trinkets ended the cancer that was 'Support lives only to ward and heal the carries' meta of S2. I don't play a lot of support, but I actually find it quite a fun role, you have a big impact on the game if you are good. But people like looking at the dmg chart and going 'Oh yeah, I did the most dmg, I must be good'. For some reason league hasn't seemed to bother with these things. It always seemed weird to me how there was so much talk about fostering talent but yet lacked these systems which do just that. Didn't Riot stop supplying small non-LAN tournaments with prizes recently. Rito also likes to control the whole competitive scene, hence lack of international tournaments, and major third party tournaments. | ||
AdsMoFro
Japan4761 Posts
There were also big issues in regards to teams often not being balanced in terms of players. Often time there'd be something like 3 support mains in one team, and you get fucked by what is essentially RNG. So how did dynamicQ change it? First off, lots of ppl started abusing 5 man stacks. In low elo, ppl often vs'd other 5 man stacks, but in higher elo the chances of being a solo/duo vs 5man was higher. In KR, even the one tricks started coming together into 5 man stacks in order to have any semblance of a chance of winning against other 5 man stacks, but in NA especially, people kept playing solo for the most part unless they were on a team. Then of course, the fact that you narrow your potential positions from 5 to 2. With smaller populations that becomes problematic, so your choice is to revert to old queue or have long queue times. Riot wants the new champ select to be synonymous with their game, high elo players are often the biggest streamers and they don't want to "dilute" their product by showing something everyone else won't play on. Now their super opaque "auto fill when queue times get too long" definitely isn't the solution and looks like a really bad fix. At the very least, you should be able to opt out of it at the cost of longer queues. | ||
M2
Bulgaria4076 Posts
On June 01 2016 12:07 Sent. wrote: Maybe its time to rework support into something thats actually fun to play for more than 10% of the playerbase Not sure how they can remake the support, since, there are 4 income sources (3 lanes & jungle) for 5 champs and there are too many champs that are designed to work with less gold while not scaling so well with it. However, I think it would be rather entertaining if the support has to support the jungle, so we have 2 hidden champs per team walking around the map ) | ||
PrinceXizor
United States17713 Posts
On June 01 2016 16:38 Numy wrote: For some reason league hasn't seemed to bother with these things. It always seemed weird to me how there was so much talk about fostering talent but yet lacked these systems which do just that. Riot shut down the last attempt by some of C9 to start up a league. and it's against EULA to use the API for a private ladder. They've deliberately prevented it as much as they can, in the west. You could rather easily create a couple twitch channels, bots, and a discord and have an API driven league that exports it's results to a website for searching, even could have ads or a sub fee for the website's features and offer stuff riot won't, prizes for top ranking, league voice chat, a more functional reporting system. But riot could shut it down easily, and considering they've shut down other attempts before. they likely would again. even if it's filling a need the community can't get from riot (solo queue and competition) | ||
Sent.
Poland8967 Posts
On June 01 2016 18:24 M2 wrote: Not sure how they can remake the support, since, there are 4 income sources (3 lanes & jungle) for 5 champs and there are too many champs that are designed to work with less gold while not scaling so well with it. However, I think it would be rather entertaining if the support has to support the jungle, so we have 2 hidden champs per team walking around the map ) I would try to do something with the gold distribution but it was just a random thought, I have no idea how to make support as enjoyable as other roles for everyone. | ||
Slusher
United States19143 Posts
it has more to do with the reasoning behind Yasuo(top) and Maokai having <1% pickrate difference than gold. ppl just don't like playing utility/tank as much as other damage, and support is the least flexible role in this regard. (although Zyra is probably back). This theory is supported by behavior of players in other games like wow and overwatch. unfortunately I personally don't think 5 dps vs 5 dps being meta would make for great games but I guess we could try it out. | ||
Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
On June 01 2016 19:04 PrinceXizor wrote: Riot shut down the last attempt by some of C9 to start up a league. and it's against EULA to use the API for a private ladder. They've deliberately prevented it as much as they can, in the west. You could rather easily create a couple twitch channels, bots, and a discord and have an API driven league that exports it's results to a website for searching, even could have ads or a sub fee for the website's features and offer stuff riot won't, prizes for top ranking, league voice chat, a more functional reporting system. But riot could shut it down easily, and considering they've shut down other attempts before. they likely would again. even if it's filling a need the community can't get from riot (solo queue and competition) I see. I always found it so strange that it never happened as almost any competitive game I know of forms pickups/cups/league super quickly. So Riot themselves shut it all down before it could get off the ground. That's rather sad. I wonder if it's another case of different parts of the company having different agendas. The Esports guys talk about fostering growth but then the game design guys remove competitive ladder and shut down any external ladder support which is direct conflict to the esports guys. Such a shame. edit: Oh wow there's a Reddit thread about this topic and the first reply is exactly what you said with the API not allowing it. Crazy stuff. It's funny how many people in there don't seem to know how that is a thing in other games and think it's some new concept lol | ||
JonnyLaw
United States3482 Posts
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739
Bearded Elder29875 Posts
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SHr3DD3r
Pakistan2137 Posts
I just want Elo back. Divisions are completely meaningless. | ||
Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
On June 01 2016 12:07 Sent. wrote: Maybe its time to rework support into something thats actually fun to play for more than 10% of the playerbase they have been for a long time you used to have to play janna and buy boots and ONLY wards for the entire game not even fucking joking then a bit later you'd get double g/10's and spend it all on more wards drizzle is reminiscing about those days and wants em back he didn't play support. nowadays supports earn close to as much as the next lowest earning guy on the team | ||
Slayer91
Ireland23335 Posts
with 200 ms still? i dunno I'd prefer both its good for newbs to think oh im gold i must be pretty good they don't know what 1400 elo means | ||
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