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Korea (South)11232 Posts
Copenhagen Wolves coach Dentist was hacked and the hacker posted Facebook chat logs which shows the conversation Dentist had about the Riot, Dentist and Deficio drama.
They also contain information in regards to the prize of their Academy team and the amount of money Azubu pays for their streamers. In addition it also included the plans Copenhagen Wolves had for their team in the future. They intended to form a super team with potential candidates of Rekkles, Freeze, ZoroZero, Cabochard, Svenskerens and more.
The chat logs can be accessed here
Dentist made a statement on Reddit:
I have not yet spoken about this publicly but at this time I would like to address a couple of things. First and foremost: I am sorry for the harm I did to Copenhagen Wolves, RIOT Games and especially my players and Deficio. At no time I had bad intentions but as it turned out, I did more harm with my actions and involvement than expected. At this point I still don't know what exactly happened and what logs got published, haven't read it or looked over it, but since every personal account of mine is hacked I just assume that every piece of "sensitive" information got "leaked" and therefore there are a few things to say.
eSports in general is a thrill for me and instantly I got hooked. I got into Copenhagen Wolves in a very lucky time - almost simultaneously to my signing the management was discussing some huge changes with the direction the Organisation wants to go and without hesitation I was riding the bandwagon of going from a team that plays for relegations to a team that is on paper able to compete with Europe's best. While it was tempting to discuss being involved in a so called "Super Team", I should have known better and not do and say what I did since it turned out to harm the players more than it helped them. My ego took over and I am very sorry for this.
Internally, I was honest to the players in the current lineup excluding Shook and including Airwaks from the time the topic came up. They knew that the Copenhagen Wolves had big plans for the future and they knew that their position is at risk. They also knew about Deficio getting an offer and possibly being involved with the Copenhagen Wolves Management in the future. All of this was not a secret. But as it turned out, it should have been because it affected my players in a bad fashion and I am sorry for this. I thought being honest to them would push their motivation to the absolute maximum - it did not and especially after the Competetive Ruling it did more harm than benefit to them. To briefly mention the Competitive Ruling, I was not honest to RIOT from the beginning for the sole reason of not harming Deficio (I did not know if Deficio has talked to RIOT before the first Skype Call I had with the RIOT executives in LCS week 1 day 1 and since the investigation was for "leaked information / strategies" I could assure them that nothing similar happened without mentioning his name) or Copenhagen Wolves (since I did not know what they know of and since nothing was set in stone I just didn't want to harm anyone but myself). Several times I mentioned to the RIOT executives that Deficio never leaked any information or in-game strategies whatsoever. Especially after the departing of Airwaks I became aware of the fact of how much this affected the players and how wrong my behaviour was. Never did I want to harm anyone. I am sincerely sorry for this.
Edit: Small edit since I get a lot of questions regarding the Azubu deal - it was never signed in the first place since CW currently has no streaming partner at all. The Copenhagen Wolves Management talked to the players after those offers and asked them what they want, also - the additional 1k was an organisation payment and not earnmarked for the players in particular.
Edit 2: Just to classify - I lied to RIOT because I did not tell them about Deficio being in talks with the Copenhagen Wolves about a possible future employment when being asked if I could imagine why rumors like this occur. I denied that we have leaked strategies / picks & bans while not mentioning Deficio whatsoever. It was about the tampering and not the leaking of informations.
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Is Skype conversations that have been obtained through illegal means really something Team Liquid will support by linking it on their page (especially when it's linked by an administrator)?
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On June 24 2015 20:44 Jek wrote: Is Skype conversations that have been obtained through illegal means really something Team Liquid will support by linking it on their page (especially when it's linked by an administrator)? Hey Jek, let me start by saying that I am completely open minded to any argument in the matter and our policies are rarely set in stone. We listen to what is reasonable and figure out how we want to do things. In this case I think that if someone hacked a major company or for example the government, that depending on what was found it can become legitimately newsworthy. What comes out of it will be reported by newspapers to their readers, even if they had nothing to do with it. We are letting people know that it happened, which it did, and that itself is news and worth discussing.
Please if you feel this is unreasonable feel free to explain more in depth.
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Just awesome that this stuff got leaked. Dentist and CW boss got owned. This might be the end for Dentist and maybe even CW org. because I doubt more players want to join them now.
I wonder if Riot had those very same chat logs and those were a major reason for their Deficio/Dentist ruling. Seems possible.
Important quote: "He is already reaching out to players. To see if they want to join him." (Dentist about Deficio)
I only feel sorry about the CW players here. No surprise that they are not motivated to tryhard and that Airwaks left.
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On June 24 2015 21:22 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:Show nested quote +On June 24 2015 20:44 Jek wrote: Is Skype conversations that have been obtained through illegal means really something Team Liquid will support by linking it on their page (especially when it's linked by an administrator)? Hey Jek, let me start by saying that I am completely open minded to any argument in the matter and our policies are rarely set in stone. We listen to what is reasonable and figure out how we want to do things. In this case I think that if someone hacked a major company or for example the government, that depending on what was found it can become legitimately newsworthy. What comes out of it will be reported by newspapers to their readers, even if they had nothing to do with it. We are letting people know that it happened, which it did, and that itself is news and worth discussing. Please if you feel this is unreasonable feel free to explain more in depth.
I can see the point of it being news worthy and I will be the first to admit I am curious, but the log itself is treading the borders of what is right or wrong to post – as an official “face” of the Liquid brand.
The issue for me is primarily from a morality/ethical point of view on this matter. The Skype correspondation is of a personal form and not pseudo-official in the likes of a major company, by openly linking to the log you are not only treading closely on the border of legal matters (at the least in Denmark you would since it's not leaked by an "inside man" in which case it'd be said person’s actions in question) but most importantly you are in a sense invading Dentist's and the unknown persons private life, regardless of their actions.
I dont have any idea how the American law system works in this matter, but I have firsthand experience of a Danish webpage getting slammed on a similar case with a Cease and Desist letter from a law firm. This brings about a genuine concern for LiquidLegends.
This is properly me being too sensitive as I have only worked as an internal administrator and have never had to make judgement calls like this. I have no qualms accepting your choice to post it. I do feel however it is an important discussion to take, while I don't find this something the community as a whole should have much of a say in, we are not the ones shaping the page. I hope it is something you might take up internally whether it be briefly or not.
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^ Dude its highest thread on lol reddit. I dont think you do additional harm to their privacy with a TL thread.
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On June 24 2015 22:09 Redox wrote:
^ Dude its highest thread on lol reddit. I dont think you do additional harm to their privacy with a TL thread.
Team Liquid is not reddit and as I've understood it they want their webpages (main and sister sites) to be held to the highest standard within the eSports scene.
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Haha this leak is awesome. There's no reason not to post it tbh because I'm sure anybody would have found it easily elsewhere.
The part where they talk about their players....holy cow. they must be upset if they read this lol... I understand now why ex pros say a player union is needed and some other people in the scene (monte it seems?) want to build a team with more "fair" contracts.
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Interesting thought I just had: The skype logs might not come from a hack, but from one of the players. One of them might have gone through Dentist's Skype logs when he was not at his PC and taken screen caps. Thus they learned they are supposed to be replaced etc. Then this player might have forwarded the Skype logs to Riot to get back at him. This would explain how Riot obtained the poaching evidence.
I think this scenario is actually quite likely.
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
All orchestrated by Freeze to ensure that CW is relegated so he can join TSM next year. Just as planned
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Not the first time the CW org has proven themselves to be shady (I seem to recall some mismanagement around the time of the old CW/NIP roster of Bjergsen, Deficio Sven etc). Owner from all accounts is very manipulative and has been caught in lies on more than one occasion.
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This is actually Facebook interface not Skype, not that it changes anything :p
Oh man so many rosterbations. Freeze and Sven to UOL. Zoro finally back on whatever team. And... that's it I guess?
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On June 24 2015 22:57 AlterKot wrote: Oh man so many rosterbations. Freeze and Sven to UOL. Zoro finally back on whatever team. And... that's it I guess? Huh? Where did you get that from?
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Baa?21242 Posts
On June 24 2015 22:05 Jek wrote:Show nested quote +On June 24 2015 21:22 Liquid`Nazgul wrote:On June 24 2015 20:44 Jek wrote: Is Skype conversations that have been obtained through illegal means really something Team Liquid will support by linking it on their page (especially when it's linked by an administrator)? Hey Jek, let me start by saying that I am completely open minded to any argument in the matter and our policies are rarely set in stone. We listen to what is reasonable and figure out how we want to do things. In this case I think that if someone hacked a major company or for example the government, that depending on what was found it can become legitimately newsworthy. What comes out of it will be reported by newspapers to their readers, even if they had nothing to do with it. We are letting people know that it happened, which it did, and that itself is news and worth discussing. Please if you feel this is unreasonable feel free to explain more in depth. I can see the point of it being news worthy and I will be the first to admit I am curious, but the log itself is treading the borders of what is right or wrong to post – as an official “face” of the Liquid brand. The issue for me is primarily from a morality/ethical point of view on this matter. The Skype correspondation is of a personal form and not pseudo-official in the likes of a major company, by openly linking to the log you are not only treading closely on the border of legal matters (at the least in Denmark you would since it's not leaked by an "inside man" in which case it'd be said person’s actions in question) but most importantly you are in a sense invading Dentist's and the unknown persons private life, regardless of their actions. I dont have any idea how the American law system works in this matter, but I have firsthand experience of a Danish webpage getting slammed on a similar case with a Cease and Desist letter from a law firm. This brings about a genuine concern for LiquidLegends. This is properly me being too sensitive as I have only worked as an internal administrator and have never had to make judgement calls like this. I have no qualms accepting your choice to post it. I do feel however it is an important discussion to take, while I don't find this something the community as a whole should have much of a say in, we are not the ones shaping the page. I hope it is something you might take up internally whether it be briefly or not.
Generally, if something is made "publicly available" (how to define that varies), there can be no legal recourse brought against anyone further disseminating it. As someone stated, this is now on top of r/lol, which is pretty much as close to publicly available information as you're gonna get in League. Legally, I can't see LL having any sorts of liability.
From a moral/ethical standpoint, I personally do not see an issue. This is something people are interested in, and discussion around the events is well within the rights of anyone who takes an interest in the issue. LL is not doing any editorializing, but simply presenting what has already become widely known. I don't believe we are treading on any sort of ethical gray ground here.
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The fappening was also publicly available. It was nevertheless taken down.
Oh wait, dentist is not a super model with an army of lawyers. Interesting...
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On June 24 2015 23:00 Redox wrote:Show nested quote +On June 24 2015 22:57 AlterKot wrote: Oh man so many rosterbations. Freeze and Sven to UOL. Zoro finally back on whatever team. And... that's it I guess? Huh? Where did you get that from? Rosterbation is the drean roster change. So "oh Sven and Hyllisang probably won't join CW now BUT WHAT IF SVEN AND FREEZE JOINED UOL INSTEAD THAT WOULD BE EVEN BETTER IT MAKES SO MUCH SENSE"
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On June 24 2015 23:33 AlterKot wrote:Show nested quote +On June 24 2015 23:00 Redox wrote:On June 24 2015 22:57 AlterKot wrote: Oh man so many rosterbations. Freeze and Sven to UOL. Zoro finally back on whatever team. And... that's it I guess? Huh? Where did you get that from? Rosterbation is the drean roster change. So "oh Sven and Hyllisang probably won't join CW now BUT WHAT IF SVEN AND FREEZE JOINED UOL INSTEAD THAT WOULD BE EVEN BETTER IT MAKES SO MUCH SENSE" I see. Kikis >>>> Svenskeren tho.
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On June 24 2015 23:33 Sufficiency wrote: The fappening was also publicly available. It was nevertheless taken down.
Oh wait, dentist is not a super model with an army of lawyers. Interesting...
well, he is pretty handsome so he might aswell try to go down the model-route after cw gets relegated
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On June 24 2015 23:39 Redox wrote:Show nested quote +On June 24 2015 23:33 AlterKot wrote:On June 24 2015 23:00 Redox wrote:On June 24 2015 22:57 AlterKot wrote: Oh man so many rosterbations. Freeze and Sven to UOL. Zoro finally back on whatever team. And... that's it I guess? Huh? Where did you get that from? Rosterbation is the drean roster change. So "oh Sven and Hyllisang probably won't join CW now BUT WHAT IF SVEN AND FREEZE JOINED UOL INSTEAD THAT WOULD BE EVEN BETTER IT MAKES SO MUCH SENSE" I see. Kikis >>>> Svenskeren tho.
I agree. While Freeze is an obvious choice for CW, Kikis is definitely better than Sven, or at least comparable. Switching junglers is always hard though, since the synergy needs to be rebuilt with the entire team.
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